S5E7: The Four Ways Trauma Manifests in our Work & Business

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In this solo episode, Dr. Lee discusses the four main ways trauma manifests in professional life, particularly for those transitioning to entrepreneurship. She shares insights from the launch of Healing Centered Business School and emphasizes the importance of self-awareness in business ownership. 

Key topics include the 'fight' response and its impact on business, avoidance behaviors, people-pleasing tendencies, and the 'fright, fade, faint' response. Dr. 

Lee also highlights the upcoming workshop on transitioning from traditional professional employment world into entrepreneurship and invites listeners to join for deeper learning and support.

00:00 Introduction and Purpose of the Episode

01:05 Launching Healing Centered Business School

03:25 The Four Main Ways Trauma Shows Up in Business

05:26 Fight Energy- For vs. Against.

11:42 Flight and Avoidance in our Work

15:24 People Pleasing and the Fawn Response

24:34 Fright, Fade, and Faint Responses 

32:05 Invitation to Join Healing Centered Business School

33:30 Upcoming Episodes and Conclusion

Transcript

[00:00:00] Hey, everyone. Welcome to this week's episode. So I am solo for this week and that's actually really intentional because we're going to be talking about something that honestly is still a little bit dysregulating for TLC to verbalize just off the cuff. And I asked him, I was like, is it cool if I just record this episode on my own?

[00:00:22] And he said, yeah, absolutely. And This is about the four main ways that trauma shows up in our work, and in particular for those of us who are shifting from a more traditional way of working to starting a business of our own or joining someone else's business There can be so many things that come up for us in terms of our past painful experiences and our current painful experiences in work and around our positive experiences from the past and our fears that maybe those positive experiences won't get extended into our present and into our futures if we start businesses.

[00:01:05] And so we I have been just having so many conversations around this as we have been planning for and beginning to launch Healing Centered Business School, and we're actually doing a workshop Thursday, September 12th at 11 a. m. Eastern, where we're talking about what it looks like to go from a healthcare provider therapist, like caring professional to creating a business that helps, you know, bring in some substantial income, whether that's a side business in addition to your work that allows you to maybe show up at work a little bit differently, show up less shift your position.

[00:01:44] Maybe stop trying to climb the corporate ladder. So to speak, or whether that's you leaving your career in a traditional job sense entirely and like shifting into doing something where you own your own business. And. It's so funny because it is hard for me to sometimes record content around this stuff because my brain goes Lee, like, you have a bunch of people who listen to this podcast because they're not entrepreneurs and they're not interested in your entrepreneur journey and it's hilarious because I was talking to our marketing person about this and his name is Travis and he was like, Lee people buy shoes from their favorite shoe brands.

[00:02:25] He used the brand Nike, which has problems of its own, as many of the very big brands do. But he used that as an example. He was like, the major shoe brands that come out with these releases of new versions of sneakers. If you love the brand, but hate the new release of sneakers, it doesn't mean you stop loving the brand.

[00:02:42] You continue to buy their shoes. You just don't buy those shoes. And I was like okay. I'm hearing you. I'm listening to you. So I, we have been launching Healing Center Business School and we already have several new humans in the program with us that are just like really benefiting from it.

[00:03:00] And so it kind of seems silly to me to not talk about this one here, particularly because we are hosting this workshop on Thursday. And I think it would be really beneficial for some of you who have maybe thought about starting a business to supplement your income or a business that maybe in, you know, a year, three years, five years, you do completely shift to being your sole source of income or one of the main sources of your income.

[00:03:25] So, Like I said, there's four main ways that trauma shows up in our businesses. And it's the four main ways that trauma shows up in our bodies and how it affects our reactions in general.

[00:03:41] And so it is really tied into how we do. One thing is how we do everything. And so a lot of times we don't recognize, we think that starting a business is going to be like the secret sauce or the magic bullet or whatever phrase you want to use to. Imply that it's going to save us. And in reality, we're going to just take some of the things that happened to us in our professional lives or in our personal lives and other places and repeat them over in our business.

[00:04:06] And so one of the things that is a huge, huge important part of Healing Center Business School is that we are teaching is we want to make sure that you're the, You become the best boss you've ever had in your business. You don't become the worst boss you've ever had. And this is the first time you are going to be in a position where you are both the employee and the boss.

[00:04:27] You are the one who is making the decisions and you are the one who is following through on the decisions. And that can be really new and weird and cause us to do some things that we're not, we don't, Recognize that we're going to do. So I want to record this just so y'all can see some of the places that you may bring some stuff into your business.

[00:04:51] And I will say, this is one of the most popular talks that I give to entrepreneurs they'll chat with me about this all the time. I get asked to give this talk a lot in business and networking and entrepreneurial spaces. If that would be beneficial for you in any of your spaces, please reach out. Happy to do that. And it's something that after people listen to it, they're like, whoa. So, I'd love to hear back from you, any of the thoughts that you have.

[00:05:15] And Also like, if you have some low moments during this in the next 15, 20 minutes, it's cool. That's normal. Please don't make yourself wrong for that. So the first one that I see is people show up in fight energy. And so they show up in fight energy in their business in one of two ways. Fight energy is one of our very first threat responses reactions that we have when our body senses threat.

[00:05:43] And fight energy shows up when we feel like we can overpower or power through whatever the sensed threat, the threat is. So some examples of this are those of us who come from professions where we fight cancer, we fight against immorality or we fight against the other side.

[00:06:10] There are a lot of professions where we are set up to try to overpower or try to win or try to be the best overcome, and we're taught to, even if it's not a particular person or against another group of humans, it's against something. And so a lot of us learn to fight against something.

[00:06:28] And so we can bring that energy into our business. And when things feel easy in our business, or it feels like there's nothing to fight against. There's not a lot of resistance. We can start getting very dysregulated by that because if we are used to constantly like fighting against our boss or fighting against an infection or fighting against something, if we're always trying to win a competition, a battle or whatever, if there's nothing to really fight against.

[00:06:59] You might make some stuff up to fight against. You might actually create some artificial resistance that you try to fight against. And this is something that I've experienced a lot after leaving my career as a critical care nurse and a bone marrow transplant nurse practitioner and, somebody who literally fought to help people stay alive.

[00:07:19] I noticed that, And it's something that my husband and several of my business coaches, current and former, have really helped me be aware of and recognize when I don't see it, which is why, again, I think coaching and having a mentor that really gets you is so important. They've been like, Lee, do you see that you're making this harder than it has to be?

[00:07:41] Lee, do you see that you're coming up with these things that you're then able to fight against instead of just like relaxing and recognizing that it's all allowed to just be. kind of be chill. So that's the fight against. The fight for energy is very similar.

[00:07:56] And a lot of times, again, it's less about resisting this other thing and having it lose. And it's more about us feeling like we've won, like we've done something, like we've accomplished something. And I see this a lot with people who exhibit something that I call toxic productivity syndrome.

[00:08:12] And this is where we are like, always focused on producing. We're always focused on growth and building and scaling and maximizing and innovating. And, the organization that I worked at before I started my business

[00:08:28] tLC was actually near there recently. And he was like, have you seen TLC? the monstrosity of the building that they have built. And I was like, yeah, because that's, that is a big part of that institution. And that organization's culture is that they're always growing. They're always innovating. They're always striving.

[00:08:45] They're always trying to do better, bigger, more. And there's nothing necessarily wrong with that from an organizational perspective. And That exhausted me from a personal perspective because I never just got a chance to pause and breathe. It was like the second that you accomplish something, you go, Oh, that was great.

[00:09:06] And then you move on to something else. And something I've realized about the business that I built was that when I set it up, I set it up in a way that I was always fighting for more clients, more money, more growth. And That will do something wonky, especially if you go through years like we have in the pandemic, where there are external factors, they're extenuating circumstances that really shift things.

[00:09:31] And, when we had a year where we went in 2022 and made 350, 000, from a revenue perspective. And then in 2023, we made 280 something thousand. You look at both of those years from a just having, bringing in cash into your business and being able to support a team of multiple people and support a family of five and do all those things.

[00:09:55] Anyone else looks at that and they're like, you're totally crushing it. And that was also really, really hard for me to regulate around because I wasn't doing what I was quote unquote supposed to do. I wasn't growing in these external metric ways. Now in reality, I was growing in a lot of ways that were so necessary for 2024, but in the moment I couldn't see that.

[00:10:16] And if you are somebody who is all, has been taught to always try to strive, drive, do more, do more, do more. If you're somebody who is constantly getting degrees and certifications and licenses and going back and getting more education. This is something that we actually talk about in our Healing Center Business School.

[00:10:35] Our school is set up in a very different way. Yeah, you're going to learn some things and it is set up to support your practical application of those things. And some of the things you're going to learn are how to stop fighting against things and how to stop. Stop always striving, driving for more of the external metrics and really making sure that things feel good, that they are in alignment with , your values.

[00:10:58] And so that might mean that some years you do take a 70, 000 income, your business makes nearly six figures less. And that is for a reason, because you are growing and ensuring your journey feels different. And that can be a hard pill for people to swallow. To be like, oh, okay I'm going to create a more regulated business, that's going to be the thing that I keep coming back to instead of fighting all the time and dysregulating myself to try to accomplish more, achieve more, do more.

[00:11:31] So that's the first way that I see trauma really impacts people. Especially when they move over from the professional setting or the work setting into their own businesses. The second way that I see is another threat reaction, threat response that we see in everybody, all mammals. And if you can't fight something, if you don't feel like you can overpower it or power through it, a lot of times what we do is we run away.

[00:11:58] We avoid. We do this thing where we evade the thing that feels scary. And so it is a lot harder to do that when someone else is your boss. It is a lot harder to avoid or evade or run away from the things on your to do list because there's somebody saying, Hey! Did you do this thing?

[00:12:19] Hey, did you get this done? Hey, I noticed that these reports were due. Um, just thinking about office space where he's like, are the TPS reports done? Right? So it is a lot harder to avoid. What we often do in the professional setting is we avoid hard conversations. We avoid rocking the boat. We avoid setting boundaries. We will run away from situations where we feel like if we spoke up, if we set boundaries, if we really. Advocated for ourselves that it might feel really uncomfortable.

[00:12:50] People might not respond in the way that we really want them to, which is to just say yes. And of course, then love all over us. Like they might have some pushback. There might be some negotiating or some compromising or some you hearing no and or not now. And so if we have past painful experiences, particularly in the workplace around, asking for what we need or speaking up when there's something that isn't going right or telling people when we're struggling to get something done because we're missing information or 

[00:13:22] we don't have enough time. We don't have enough resources. We don't have enough energy. If we struggle with that, guess what happens when you run your own business? There's no one there. It's a check on you other than you. And so if you are avoiding the thing, you might do like a weird flip floppy thing where you're fighting against yourself.

[00:13:41] Part of you is fighting against you and being like, Oh my gosh, I don't understand why you can't figure this out. And you're like shaming yourself, being mean to yourself over trying to overpower yourself so you can get yourself to push through. And then this other part of you is like, yeah, no, I'm not going to do that.

[00:13:55] And, that second part of you, that avoidant evasive part, it might avoid sending messages back to potential clients. It might avoid posting your offers. out on social media or printing them in traditional media or talking to people at network groups or even going to a networking group. It might lead you to avoid doing your finances or really sitting down and setting up an operational system for yourself that works because maybe you don't have a lot of experience in tech.

[00:14:24] It can feel scary for people who are very knowledgeable in their fields of expertise to start a business because you have to become a novice again. And that can feel really wobbly when you're used to being an expert somewhere else. And so if that's something you don't feel like you can power through, or maybe you try to fight through it and you can't figure it out and you're not sure who to ask, you might avoid.

[00:14:49] So that is the second way that I see trauma effect, especially if people have been taught that they're not allowed to ask questions that they're supposed to be perfect off the bat, that they should be able to execute the first or second time they try something. They should be able to easily figure things out.

[00:15:03] Really smart people struggle with this because y'all are like, Oh, I should know how to do this. And it's like, I'm sorry. Did anybody ever show you how to create a funnel or how to map out a customer journey or how to file your quarterly income taxes or how to do any of these things? Because if they didn't, Why should you know how to do this?

[00:15:22] Why should you know how to figure it out? So the third one is, I will see people show up in a people pleasing mentality in their businesses, and we call that fawn in the trauma space. And so fawning can manifest in two ways as well. So the first way is people and people pleasing looks like where we We will basically do things to make other people happy.

[00:15:47] So if you have a past, if you have a lot of past painful experiences that taught you to appease other people, to say yes to them, when you wanna say no, to say no to them, when you wanna say yes, to say, maybe when you really actually have an answer, just to kind of, maybe there's a little. Flight energy coming in there to avoid the conversation, but you don't want to hurt people's feelings.

[00:16:07] You don't want to, you don't want to like, you just want to be the nice one. You want to be the kind one. You want to be the one that everyone thinks is just such a good person. If you have that experience, if that is how you have learned to navigate hard or uncertain or threatening situations in the workplace, then when you start a business, you're going to do things with potential clients, with potential collaborators, with yourself, with your coach, with your partner.

[00:16:38] Partner, you're going to do this with everyone. So maybe you are going to have a business idea and then you're going to mention it to somebody who is not probably the best person to have a conversation with around a business idea. Cause they always, you know, um, poo poo, everything that you think up and they're going to go, that's a stupid idea.

[00:16:56] Why would you ever do that? And you're going to go, Oh yeah, you're right. I'm sorry. I'm not doing that. Or maybe your partner, Is really like nervous about the amount of money you want to invest in something and you have never learned how to have a conversation where you're able to like calmly and rationally and vulnerably talk with them about your desires and your wants and your plan for how you're going to Use this investment because maybe no one's ever taught you how to be that regulated in a conversation like that then you might end up not investing in something that you think would be really beneficial, still trying to start your business anyway, spending 6, 12, 18 months plus.

[00:17:35] And then you're like, well, this didn't work and it's my fault. I'm a failure. And then your partner's like, see, you see, we shouldn't have invested in this because it didn't work because, and you're like, I know. And There's this small voice in the back of your head that's like, but what would it look have looked like if you were supported?

[00:17:52] What would it have looked like if I actually trusted myself and invested in this thing and? Gave myself the resources I needed in order to be able to be successful. What would that look like if I actually spoke up for myself and my needs? So people pleasing, you might drop your prices.

[00:18:14] This is like when you're in your professional job and your boss asks you, Asks you to do more work for the same amount of money Your boss asks you to stay late. They offer you a promotion that has a title change and no compensation change whatsoever. And you're like, oh, that's fine. That's great.

[00:18:29] You're gonna bring that over to the work with your clients. You're going to undercharge, you're gonna overwork, you're gonna offer discounts, you're gonna add in all this stuff. And the main thing I see happen with people who have a people pleasing response in their business is resentment.

[00:18:45] It's resentment. They are very, very envious because resentment is in the envy family of emotions. They are envious and they wish that they could get their needs met the way that they meet everyone else's needs. And so they become resentful of their clients. They become resentful of their coworkers. They become resentful of their partners.

[00:19:08] And envy is one of those emotions that turns into like, rage. Envy is one of those emotions that gets shoved down, and it bubbles up, and it bubbles up, and it bubbles up, and then it bursts out, typically in rage, and typically in a I'm not willing to help anybody anymore. It looks very martyr esque.

[00:19:30] It looks very sanctimonious, like I've done everything for everyone else and no one ever does anything for me, so forget it, I'm out. And then after we have that emotional response, there's this experience of like, oh my gosh, I can't believe I just did that, and so I just bothered everybody, I just hurt everybody.

[00:19:49] So now I need to double down on the people pleasing even more. See, this is, it's dangerous for me to have wants. It's dangerous for me to have needs. So I see that come through a lot. The other side of bond energy is something that we call cryo attach for help. And cryo attach for help is, some other words for this would be damsel.

[00:20:06] in distress. This looks like, doe eyes. This is when we revert back to like very young child, toddler, baby, like energy and we act helpless. And it is a way to get people to save us because we feel and I want to be really clear. We don't feel like we can't be so there's a sense of I am helpless.

[00:20:34] And in reality, This is an emotionally manipulative response, reaction. And cry attach for help is one of the responses that I think is the least understood in humanity as a whole, but particularly in business. And it's a response that I have sometimes. It's a response that I didn't often show at work.

[00:20:54] I would often show people very close to me, but you all have seen people do this at work , or maybe you've done this at work. And so there's no shame in this. All right. It happens. But this is where you fall apart and you cry and you sob or you literally fall into a heap on the floor and you start talking about how you can't do anything right and you're a failure and none of this is going to work and you're so overwhelmed and insert your favorite phrase here and then other people are like, Oh my gosh, I see you.

[00:21:19] How can I help? How can I help? The thing is if you're doing that in your business that gets really gnarly. Gets really gnarly, particularly if you do cry attach for help with clients because you're putting yourself in a childlike state where they have to rescue you, and they're going to do one of two things.

[00:21:39] They're either going to run like the wind they're going to bolt, because that they're like, oh gosh, this was supposed to be something where you and I were working together, you were supporting me, and now I'm supporting you, it's not going to go well. Or, they're going to step in and save you, and rescue you, and guess what, you have just now flipped the dynamic.

[00:22:00] In your relationship with this client, you have now an inverse power dynamic and not that It's necessarily good for us to have power dynamics in relationships and in some businesses we both have power and the power that we have in the relationship it's equitable, but it's not the same.

[00:22:21] They're both empowered in the roles we're in our relationship as client and business owner and It's my client's job to fall apart, right? It's my client's job to have a damsel response and for me to hold them through that and in some business settings it's neither person. Is it acceptable or helpful for their relationship. I hold clients through processing trauma. I hold clients through their really tough moments in business. I hold clients and help them understand their trauma reactions and responses. So they like, if they don't come out while we're working together, then we can't work on them.

[00:22:58] So I always let people know, especially in a place like Healing Center Business School, if you show up in damsel energy, I got you. You don't scare me. If you show up in We've got you. You don't scare us. You can show up in any of these energies and you're not going to scare us because we know what they are.

[00:23:13] We recognize them for what they are. And we're going to support you in recognizing them yourself and understanding why you show up that way, not from a judgmental place, but from a curious place. And we're going to support you in figuring out like what the need is underneath of that. And In typical business and client business owner relationships, that dynamic is going to cause some pretty significant damage.

[00:23:38] I believe that all of these responses, these trauma responses cause ruptures to our relationships, and this is one of the ones that Is most clearly able to be seen in a relationship because again, we're quote unquote adults, so we're not supposed to revert back to childlike ways, and if we do, it can really rock the confidence of our clients.

[00:24:02] So. If you are somebody who exhibits the cry attach for help response, guess what? It's fine. You're normal. There's nothing wrong with you. It just means that there's probably some pretty significant stuff that happened when you were a kid that didn't get processed. And that's why you still show up that way.

[00:24:17] And that's okay because that can get shifted. And it's something you're going to want to consider as you move into business, knowing okay, whenever this thing happens, I go into cry attach for help. So I gotta be ready for that. I gotta have a plan for that and that can make all the difference.

[00:24:34] So then the fourth and final response is something that we call fright, fade, faint. So this is when our nervous system goes, okay, I can't fight off this threat. I can't run away from this threat. I can't emotionally trick this threat into seeing me as something it doesn't want to hurt, whether that's as a a childlike thing or it's a really nice kind thing.

[00:25:00] Like, a lot of predators don't want to eat prey. That is really nice, right? A lot of us, we don't want to hurt people or go after people who are like, I'm not hurting you. I'm not threatening. I'm fine. We don't want to do that. The fright fade faint is what happens when we shift from I must fight this thing off.

[00:25:19] I must get this threat to go away to, I can't fight this threat off. And so basically our nervous systems are super smart and they're like, look if a threat can't be fought off or ran away from or manipulated out of, I'm a check out. So fright, we experienced tonic immobility. This is where we end up like as deer in the headlights.

[00:25:44] And a lot of business owners do this when something unexpected happens. A lot of people at work do this when something unexpected happens they literally get frightened and they freeze. I would see this occasionally in. The hospital setting where you would have an emergency occur and somebody would just get like their shoes were glued to the floor and you're like snapping in their face trying to get them to snap out of it.

[00:26:08] You might have even seen this on TV shows where somebody's like just stuck and I don't condone this, but they'll come up and kind of smack them or like shake them and then they wake them up out of it. That is fright. That is deer in the headlights. That is tonic immobility. So that is where our body is frozen and our brain is just like ruminating.

[00:26:28] And so fright is something that actually shows up a lot, a lot, and the low level fright that I see is people getting stuck inside their heads and not moving. So they're at their desk and they're on their computer and they're just scrolling or they're trying to fix this thing and they're in it for two hours.

[00:26:48] And they look up and they're like, what just happened? Where am I? What's going on? And it's not happening from this like relaxed flow state where they're really in the vibes and getting the work done. This is like, I I got stuck in overwhelm and my brain was spinning. My thoughts were racing and I couldn't figure out what to do next.

[00:27:08] So it looked like I was fine because I was answering like, uh huh. Yeah. Okay. In the meeting or At my desk and in reality, like I was spinning out. And so if that comes over in your business again, this can be hard because if you're the boss and the worker and you go into fright, like it's, there's nobody there to notice that you're in it necessarily.

[00:27:33] And so when you notice that you're in it, you're going to have to have some ways to pull yourself out of it. And this also goes for the back half of this hypoarousal I can't fight off the threat response, which is the fade and faint piece. This is where our brain goes, hey, this is going to be way too painful, so we're going to check out.

[00:27:54] We're either going to dissociate and start thinking about other things and not even be mentally present with our bodies in this room, or We're going to pass out and one of the things I see happen with people who have this reaction is they get really tired. They get really, really tired, really, really sleepy, and it's hard for them to get out of bed.

[00:28:15] It's hard for them to not take a nap. It's hard for them to just be mentally present for their work, and it's like beyond just being fatigued. It's beyond being fatigued. It is, I can't get my brain to be here with me in part of this process. And so this can feel really scary for people when they start their business.

[00:28:42] Sometimes when they, and particularly when they leave a very stressful job environment, sometimes their body will like, slow down a lot and be like, Oh my gosh, I've been so tired for so long. And they will, sleep a bunch and lose like all their energy and just be really exhausted and have a hard time getting their work done.

[00:29:07] And when they're used to being in that fight for or fight against mode for so long, they're like, what is wrong with me? What is happening? And one of the things I have to explain to them is part of this is just your body coming back into regulation. And part of what might be happening is, you've been in hyper and hypo arousal.

[00:29:26] Like you've been in, Simultaneously in fight and fright, fade, faint mode this entire time, but the fight mode was winning out. And now that we've taken you out of the place where you experienced fight mode, the fright, fade, faint is all that's left. The hypoarousal is still active and so, Your body needs some rest.

[00:29:51] Your body needs some nourishment. Your body needs some hydration. Your body needs to know that it is safe for you to just stay this slow for at least a little bit. And so this is why, if you're like, Oh yeah, I'm working 80 hours weeks right now. And so if I leave my job and I'm only going to work 20 hour weeks, then this should be totally fine.

[00:30:10] And I'll just be able to make like eight times what I was making. I have to tell people I'm like, look, that might happen. You might be good. And we also want to plan for if you really struggle to work for those first couple of months because you are recovering from the trauma and the chronic depletion that you've been in for the last several decades.

[00:30:31] It's always something that I encourage people to think about. Like I said, it doesn't happen to some people. Some people are like, Oh, I feel so much better. And they're just good. And it's It's also can feel life threatening. It can feel really threatening to your nervous system to leave something that it has known for a really long time, even if that thing it knew was harmful, even if that thing wasn't healthy, our nervous systems will keep us in situations sometimes, not because they are good for us or healthy for us, but because they are known to us, they are familiar to us.

[00:31:05] And so we get to recognize that just because we can logically reason that our new business is better for us health wise, holistically, long term, our body still might feel really scared. Our nervous system might feel really scared and I will just say, like, part of me doesn't like saying this, and the other part of me is like, and it's true, the vast majority of business programs out there do not talk about any of this. The vast majority of business programs out there will teach you the strategy of business. Some of them will teach you the foundation.

[00:31:44] Some of them will teach you more of the energetic. Some of them will do both. Viewer will do both. And I rarely see to the level that I think is necessary for people, any other program other than ours talk about this nervous system piece like this, there might be some out there.

[00:32:02] I'm not saying that they don't exist. I'm saying that I have not found them. And so if you're someone that like you've been really thinking about starting a business, you've been thinking about shifting out of this full time working for someone else or thinking about adding in supplemental income, thinking about doing something on your own where you are your own boss.

[00:32:24] And you're like, Ooh, some of these trauma responses might show up in my current work and so they might show up in my business invitation to join us and healing center business school invitation to come to the workshop. With us on Thursday. If you are listening to this after September 12th, we're gonna evergreen the workshops.

[00:32:45] So don't worry the link that you see in the show notes below will either take you to the live version or it will take you to the evergreen, the recorded version that you can immediately watch after September 12th. So either way, it's gonna be available for you. And Healing Center Business School is open for enrollment around the clock.

[00:33:03] Like it's always open for you to join so I, you don't have to feel like you are, you missed out on anything or you have to rush to get in there. Like If there's one thing I hope you take away from this, it's that trauma speeds us up. And things happen too soon, too fast, or it slows us down and we don't get enough or we don't get it on time. We don't get it in the time frame that we need it. And so, we're not, we're not going to create any false senses of dysregulation, urgency, scarcity in this program We are completely unwilling to do that and I look forward to further episodes of the podcast as TLC steps into the COO role because I think he's going to be able to share with you some of the ways that this has come up for him and thank you for vibing with me solo while he's off learning his COO role.

[00:33:55] And we're going to be back together with one of our team members next week, Brittany Bowman, and that episode is, we don't spill tea, y'all, like, you know, we don't spill tea, we don't name names, we don't do things like that, because I just, I don't think it's helpful, and we're going to be talking about some of the toxicity and some of the shame based behaviors and some of the dysregulating things That we have all personally experienced from the coaching industry and sharing some resources for all of you who maybe are thinking about hiring us as teachers or coaches or mentors or hiring someone else, or maybe you're a coach or a mentor and you're really wondering, am I setting up my clients for success?

[00:34:37] Or am I leading to re traumatization? Am I dysregulating their nervous systems further? We're going to be talking about a lot of that. That episode will be next week and we're really excited to bring it to y'all. So head to the show notes, check out the workshop Just if you're like, I already know I'm in Lee and you want to read the details on healing center business school, those will be linked below as well.

[00:34:57] And we're excited to have those of you who choose to join us in there with us.